The Haiku
66
Because I've been accused of writing stuff that is too long
I make no apology for the following, I have been accused of writing stuff that’s far too long; especially my poetry, so I am bowing to popular demand, and providing three poems for your delectation (That’s a posh way of saying I want you to look at it and kind of like it),
I have decided on the Haiku form which is sort of foreign; Japanese people invented it, and they do it well, but they have allowed non Japanese people to have a try and some non Japanese people do it well too.
Haiku (plural Haiku) usually deals with arty farty stuff like nature and all that business. They look dead simple in structure, because they only have three lines with seventeen syllables arranged; five, seven, five. But beware, they look easy but they’re well difficult.
One of the best poems ever was written by an American called Ezra Pound. It sort of sounds like a Haiku but it’s only got two lines and there are too many syllables, but I like it, and as it’s my hub, I’m including it. (I may bow to popular demand sometimes, but only when that’s the way I want to go).
If you look carefully, and your mathematics is up to it, there are three poems here. I’m going to call them all Haiku (Remember; the plural and the singular is Haiku).
The first is written by Ezra Pound who I’ve told you about already; the second is by me; the third is written by someone who wouldn’t give his name (or maybe it was a lady poet, and she wouldn’t give her name).
The apparition of these faces in a crowd
Petals on a wet, black bough
Ezra Pound
The Mathematics of despair.
I was born too early;
You, too late.
Five syllables first
Secondly it is seven
Then five is haiku
Anonymous
By the way; I still think Lady Poets should be called Poetesses.
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I adore this type of prose but then again I adore most types, and yours is awesome! Sometimes fewer words say more than a lot of words.
Splendid!
Blessings, and hugs,
Laurie
Thanks, Mark. Of course I always bow to the inevitable. I am such a self effacing person. And naturally I accept criticism, both positive and negative, in the spirit in which it is given.
Thank you, Laurie. My only aim is to please and to go through life spreading a little sunshine and joy to all around... yeah right!
Thanks for looking in and perusing my humble offering.
You can't say much with
Seventeen syllables, but
That's Haiku for you!
"The Great Wave Off Kanagawa" is a painting by Katsushika Hokusai (1760-1849). He was a most un-Japanese artist, and Hokusai wasn't his real name, he changed his name a lot for fun.
Sometimes just called "The Wave", one point of artistic significance is this: turn it upside-down, a similar wave of air is visible. Yin and Yang.
Wow, I'm reading a poem and I don't even know that I am. That's my kind of poem. I think I kinda like it. :)
Pierre, I thank you for your comment. I Google searched "your" Haiku and it didn't turn up. Does that mean it's your very own? I am impressed, but regardless, thank you for visiting
Thank you, Wandererh. It's nice to see you here again. Come back any time... you are most welcome.
i don't write haiku because it's too exacting for me. I'm brief but totally undisciplined. But I'm a critic. I think that most haiku is not (haiku). When I told my nephew (who cheerfully thought he'd found his literary niche) that his brief poems were nice but just brief poems, not haiku, he disowned me, I think. (But he only turned up at my door about once every decade, anyway.)
Not only is the form regimented, but the subject is, as well. It is impersonal and non-esoteric. It is not subjective. It's observational and somewhat objective-- and about everyday things. Generally personal pronouns unhaiku it, - especially first person pronouns. If one wants to write about one's feelings, spirituality or relationships, haiku is not the way to go. Haiku may inspire readers to think about their own feelings, spirituality or relationships but it does so without reference to them.
I must admit that I cringe when I read bad haiku. hehe Anonymous did it well. (I think). Ezra's subject is good but the form wants. Yours goes out of its way to defy the rules. Hehehehehe. I love it.
Remember all female poets aren't ladies, though. ;-)
Your illustrations are exquisite! I'm hooked on you!
I don't want to please the crowd
But I will do it anyways,
Because conforming gives me pleasure
While I refuse to accept that I conform.
That is not Haiku, it is only my response,
An expressed impression
In a perfectly third and foreign language
In a poetic form which was never my forte.
I love short poetry and Haiku, and especially the painting "The Wave" - I had quite a story associated with it.
I wish translating poetry was easier, but I think it is the toughest task, it is even harder than writing it.
And in us the desire burns still,
To it trains leave
Also the butterfly of consciousness rushes
From nowhere no nowhere...
*******************************************
There is a burning desire in us
Trains still leave for that destination
And the butterfly of our consciousness
Rushes from nowhere to nowhere. (Victor Pelevin)
*******************************************
[destination - meaning "burning desire"]
[from "nowhere to nowhere" beginning of our consciousness before birth
(or rather the beginning of what we can remember, that comes only at a certain age) to the end of it, after death].
*******************************************
I think it is more or less a Buddhist concept. What can I say? I am a floating leaf at the moment, floating aimlessly, from nowhere to nowhere...
I'm getting prose, not haiku...Nice prose, but undisciplined haiku...no aHa moments in these offerings...No disparity between the first and second lines...No reconciliation found in the third line...Just simple prose...And yes, haiku is about nature and its interconnectivity...Emotive subjects are best left to sonnets, ballads, and prose poetry...
The example of Pound's poem is more in the hokku style than haiku...
I love the discipline and intense concentration required to write haiku in its truest form..no wonder haiku appealed to the Samurai...Larry
Nellieanna, there comes a time in every man's life (and I include Lady Poets and Poetesses and even Versifiers with the basic concepts of Mathematics) when he/she/they wished that cans of worms contained anything but worms... Worms are so uncooperative, haven't you noticed?
Give them a head start (whichever end that may currently be) and there's no dissuading them.
Ah! The Buddhist concept. I wish I had found something shorter to spike the guns of my critics, but Limericks are too raunchy on the whole or tend to be tedious. Maybe I should have just wallowed in a plethora of self indulgent words and stuck two fingers up; meanwhile wandering off into obscurity.
The shorter concept?
I loved the conversation from a famous book:
- What is your motto?
- Always.
The shortest form is probably one word or even one sound.
Like "aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah" - whatever meaning you are willing to ascribe to it.
Pain?
Pleasure?
Call for help?
"I am here, damn it!"
The beauty is everywhere - in a long, in a short form, in formlessness. In too many sounds, in a melody, in symphony, in total silence, which is internet with no sound effects.
Ian, just write what you like and what you feel like writing. Form, like the definition, is a way to limit. Even in mathematics, there is infinity and there is precision.
And critics? They need writers, but I don't think writers need critics. Maybe they do. I remember the times when I loved reading film reviews by a certain lady critic (critic-ess?) - she was wonderful in her creativity and meanness.
but it gets tiring after a while. Too much negativity. You cannot do this! You should never do this! Oh, well...
*******************************************************
Silver bluebell, are you singing,
Or, perchance, my heart is dreaming?
Light from rosy icon flashes
Falling on my golden lashes.
Though I’m not that gentle infant
in the flapping splash of pigeons,
Yet my dreams are sweet and distant,
Somewhere in the woodland regions.
I don’t need the narrow house,
Word and mystery won’t welcome.
Teach me, please, to dream and drowse,
Fall asleep and never waken.
(Serguei Yesenin)
Maven, to paraphrase George and Ira Gershwin:
"You say Hokku and I say Haiku...
Tra la la!"
Pound's poem, as I pointed out "… sort of sounds like a Haiku but it’s only got two lines and there are too many syllables”... In fact, it was a description of the Paris Métro. Perhaps it matters to you whether it's the Métropolitain for Châtelet-Les Halles or Château Rouge or elsewhere, but if it appealed to the Samurai, then all the worse; a lot of noise and bruised fingers, if nothing else.
That, Svetlana, is so lovely. You have the advantage of two languages to wallow in... Lucky you.
Thats a nice poem you have here. is so good.
And after coming straight from reading Nellieanna's lovely hub? I am honoured. Please come again soon.
haha i found your captions in your pictures to be amusing
I also really liked yours.
It seems to have multiple meanings.
I was born too early/you, too late.
leaves the mind guessing.
Great hub :]
Ok, so do I have to do a Haiku in three lines, following the rules of 5, 7, 5 syllables, or does it have to just be 17 syllables? The definition I read said it's supposed to be 5, 7, 5, and it should have a "nature" word in it. So can I include a nature word, and make it about feelings? Because somebody said it shouldn't be about feelings either. And then I'm supposed to make the darn thing connect together at the end? See why I don't write poetry, or Haiku, or whatever the heck this stuff is called?? I need a teacher...anybody know a good one?? Oh wait, I DO! It's YOU!!! :) So tell me if this counts:
Winter lives in me
My heart remains frozen still
Warm me with your love
See, 5, 7, 5, a nature word, but it contains emotions so I suppose it doesn't count as a real Haiku? You tell me. Rules confuse me! :)
Angie, if that isn't a Haiku, then what is it? To me it sounds beautiful.
I would be proud to have written it myself.
I'm hopeless with Haiku. I just wander around in words, and if they work, they work... but this one is lovely.
Thank you. The way I see it, if we like it, that's all that matters!
Thank you for the effort at haiku! It's always good to try new things.
I do want to scold you, however. The "very typical sea scape by some Japanese artist" is "The Great Wave" by Katsushika Hokusai. Hokusai is probably Japan's best-known artist, Ian!
I do not hang my head in shame. I hoped that a few more people realised that I was taking the piss... err... talking with my tongue firmly in my cheek.
I, frankly, couldn't give a bugger for the Haiku (or the Hokku). I am no intellectual; I am what is known in this country as an Oik.
I must try to be more overt in future!
I figure you're usually talking tongue-in-cheek, as we have that in common. ;)
I had to look up Oik. You're nothing of the sort.
When I'm serious, I'm serious.
When I'm arty farty, I'm arty farty.
When I'm being flippant (polite way of saying that @m taking the piss), I'm being flippant.
You just have to take me when and where you find me (as the Actress said to the Bishop).
Oh, no, the haiku I wrote was not mine. It might have been written in a different form: "Twice five syllables / Plus seven can't say much but / That's Haiku for you!"
And that's Haiku for you, indeed.
I find the time spent on this art form tedious in the extreme... but at least if a few more "poetic" hubbers were to attempt it, there would be less of the awful forcing of rhyming couplets, regardless of meaning...
Turgid and adolescent themes excluded.
Emily Dickinson and Patience Strong eat your collective (and defunct) hearts out... too many crimes against language have been committed in your emulation.
I'm scared to ever again force any rhyming couplets in your presence Ian...you're a couplet snob I do believe. haha How are you friend, I haven't talked to you much lately!
No, and I have missed you, as well. And believe it, my dear friend, it was not you I was referring to. I do rhyming couplets, but when I read some of the stuff on here I get so incensed when the "poetry" is poor; rhyming to the point where it means nothing; badly spelled.
I've said it before, but if the children I taught had produced stuff like that, I wouldn't have been nasty, but i would have said something like, "Try again, it's a bit silly, and it doesn't make any sense".
And the ones i am thinking about churn out at least one "poem" per day and it's crap.
Angie, I like your writing, you know I do.
I didn't think you were referring to me...I just love to tease you! I'm thinking of doing a hideous rhyming poem all spelled incorrectly just to further antagonize you. It's the brat in me coming out! :)
Well make shore you're speling is write and their aunt any misstakes and yule bee awl rite. Relie on me and isle B you're fiend.
Thats Watt Im hear 4.
And here, Angie, is a poem that I have always found very uplifting and beautiful. It should inspire you in your quest to write a beautiful poem.:
The Elephant
A sweet little bird is the elephant;
He flits from bough to bough.
He lays his eggs in peanut trees,
And whistles like a cow.
I'm wondering if it's a Freudian slip that you typed "isle be you're fiend" fiend instead of friend, or will you really be my fiend??? I'm fine with it either way!
And your poem is gorgeous...truly poignant and eloquent beyond words my fiend. :)
Nothing was Freudian. I may have the typographical skills of a poorly trained octopus, but when it comes to writing the wrong word and spelling incorrectly, it is a hard task. There isn't a homophone for friend (that I know of) so I just had to make do.
My little three line (not a) Haiku, was very much from the heart, but don't tell anybody... We're safe; no one reads my hubs, anyway.
I would tell everybody but nobody listens to me but you anyway so your secret is safe with me! ha And I know you wrote that "not a" Haiku for me... :) I'm very full of myself today. I'm also going to start calling you Fiend Ian.
Hmm....big sister is always watching. :) And reading, and stalking about.
I can be as fiendish as you wish, Angie. And you were going to push some writing past me and let me look at it... did you forget?
I need to know that there is someone out there who has a mind and is interested in what I like and love.
I've got to the stage where i can't be bothered making any more postings... Am I being too introspective, or is there just a lot of time being wasted here?
It all seems to be about Google and what it is or isn't doing for anyone. Not you, my dear fiend, just the others, and I don't mean Laurie either,.. I have made some fabulous friends here who I think I will retain when I jack this in (English expression), but I don't think I will miss some of the crap that is served up by others.
Hi, Laurie. You aren't stalking; you know you are so welcome. I just feel, as you will notice if you will read what I said to Angie, that this HP is going nowhere for me. I love writing and, as you may notice, I love showing off, but I am a very slow writer and an even slower reader, (almost) and I find I am reading or trying to read so much and find that I am not doing any writing for myself,
I haven't written anything at all for three to four days, and at about 400 words on a good day, that isn't going to get much done.
I went to bed last night and thought to myself, “Why don’t I just give up?” I have proven to myself that what I have written is OK and that has given me the impetus to try to do some more for myself, but apart from a very few kind and understanding friends, I just can’t be arsed (another English expression).
Maybe I am just tired and need to go to bed and everything will be OK in the morning, but Twilight Lawns plc have seen neither hair nor hide of me for weeks and Mrs Plantagenet-Featheringstonehaugh has sent out search parties because she thinks I have gone AWOL..
OK, I’ve stopped moaning and feeling sorry for myself.
Big hug.
Ian
Ian,
I'm afraid the Alzheimers has set in as I'm not exactly sure which writing you're referring to...you should refresh my memory if it was in regards to a certain subject.
I do know what you're talking about in regards to the Hub though. I was thinking rather the same thing myself for the last few days. It seems everyone starts out rather "gung ho", and you get a lot of traffic at first, and then it feels as if it is just yourself, and a few stalwart few responding.
At the risk of sounding greedy, because I am, I do so hope you will continue to write and let me read your works, my fiend. I absolutely adored "The Potter" and am waiting eagerly for the next installation.
I wish I had your creativity. I so very much want to write, I honestly just can't seem to think of a subject or story that has any interest. My brother has all of these wonderful ideas, and is so very creative, and I can't get him to write them! Sigh....if only I'd been given his brain! HA
Big hugs and a tiny kiss to you...xoxo
Angie
If I thought de greek's use of words quite intimidating in their elegance.Yours are absolutely terrifying for a trying but ardent student like me of the English language :) reminds me of my former English teacher who was very strict on our use or more likely misuse of the language. The short article on the Haiku did provide delectable reading but not to be outdone was the dessert provided by your scrumptious comments
I wrote a few "Haiku" hubs but I think the 5/7/5 format was the only thing I did correctly :) Thank you also for pointing out that the plural form of Haiku is still Haiku.
I'll make the necessary changes :)
Angie, that was such a lovely comment. You said at one time that you would appreciate a bit of "mentoring" if you wrote some poetry. That is all.
The HP thing really is beginning to wear me out. I actually dreams that I am setting up a hub, but in my real life I am not writing at all now, except for a minimal amount of words.
My oldest friend (not old, but I've known her the longest in this world) has written four very successful books and I want to do a hub on each of them, to see if she gets any more sales... not that she needs them. Then, I think, I will stop posting and occasionally come on to read from my real friends... and there are several, you and Laurie, definitely, included.
I have a poem I wrote years ago about Easter, and perhaps I will wait till then; publish it as a hub, and make it my "Swan song".
Don't worry, we still have each other's e-mail addresses, and as long as you want to be in contact, that will be lovely for me.
Thank you, SilentReed for your visit. I have read some of your hubs and am very impressed. Comments like yours, from a person who puts so much effort and research into the hubs that you do, are accepted with humility and appreciation.
My short, but tongue in cheek, article on the Haiku was done in a spirit of fun and I was amazed how many people did not realise that I frankly couldn't give a bugger for this very formal type of construction of a poem.
Obviously, if it follows all the rules, and is pleasant to the ear or to the senses, then wonderful. But I can remember being taken to task because I had not fulfilled the criteria for each line as dictated by some ancient intellectual.
I, by no stretch of the imagination, can be termed an intellectual; I just like words and the feelings they can evoke.
Sorry if my words can be "absolutely terrifying". I majored in English when I was at Teachers' College, so I obviously like the language, but I also would like the world and his wife (and his dog) to love their own mother tongue as well. Mine, I suppose is English, but regardless of the language, if it is worth speaking and writing, then I must be honoured with love, understanding and respect.
Wow! What a lot of rubbish I write sometimes.
Oh yes, the mentoring. Unfortunately I've been unable to come up with anything worth sharing. Poetry really is not my strong suit anyway. Laurie loves it, but I'm afraid I just don't enjoy it quite as much as she does. I love to read it if it is done well, which in my opinion just means if it moves me. I'm not "up" on all the rules and regulations, I just know what I like, what moves me, what interests me. Most of yours falls into that category...because I think you write from your heart, and it shows. And that is not just flattery for the sake of flattery either. I'm afraid I'm not very good at that! My mother always tells me I am "just like my father" in that I usually say whatever I think..even if occasionally too honest! I have learned to temper it a bit over the years, so as not to hurt feelings.
Anyway, I won't ramble forever and bore you silly, we're on our way out to the resale shops to and to do a few errands.
I certainly wish to keep in touch with you! I'm hoping you're going to share more of The Potter with me, as well as other things you would be willing to share. But only things you already have online so it doesn't take away from your writing! You must get back to it, you are too talented, and it means far too much to you for you to spend time doing other things that mean less. I hope that made sense, it did in my head! :)
Kiss and hug my favorite fiend,
Angie
Thanks Angie, thank you from the bottom of my heart. Enjoy your shopping and I will get back to you and write something a bit longer when I have eaten.
Big hug and a kiss to you too, my fiend.
Ian
Haiku is actually so difficult to write but you have managed to achieve this and your words are so spot on. Pressing those tabs as always.
You are so lovely. Thank you. Several people think I have made a mess up of it and I should have dome this and that... but frankly, Acaetnna, I'm not bothered. So long as it sounds "sort of" right, that will do me! Thank you for always coming through for me... it is much appreciated.
Ian,
I feel the same way most days, and to be honest I only write when the "feeling" hits. And most of the time it is during a panic or something related. My poetry is born out of the darkness of despair at times, often misunderstood, and as far as proper form, I don't care. :) Horrid fact there, but I love to write it, just don't do it proper.
I do adore your writings tho, and peering into the "mind" of others. One of my quirks, I love seeing how people feel, react, through their words. And yours Dear Friend are incredible. So if you do leave, please keep in touch ! I will surely miss you and your awesome writings.
Laurie
xoxo
Laurie, be it on your collective heads. If I stop sulking long enough to stay, it will be because of your comments and encouragement, and that of Angie. I went grumbling off to bed last night like a spoilt child, and then I realised that: Without the kind words and approval of people like you and Angie and one or two others, I wouldn't have had my highs.
So, bugger HP and all the negative things about it, I must remember that there are lots of lovely aspects to is as well.
Thanks for being there for me (My, how I hate that expression, "Being there for me", but in this instance I mean it).
Hugs
x
Ezra Pound, lovely.
But you, more lovely than he.
Poetry sings to heart.
I totally agree about the poetesses thing.
Thank you for pointing out that the plural for haiku is haiku. I always suspected something strange with that conjugation, now I have it put into words. It was a lightbulb moment for me.
Glad you enjoyed your visit to mine. You seem to run an entertaining and zesty enterprise over here.
Good to meet you, Doug
Glad to meet you too, Doug. I will be visiting more often; I liked what I found.
Whether short or long, your way with words is appealing and - yes- highly delectable. The turn of the phrase, the sly sense of humour and the eloquence even in your comments is appealing. I'm going to read more.
I am so pleased that you ARE going to read more Docmo... this little effort, as I think you have already realised, was very tongue in cheek.
Ian,
This is very interesting to me. I really do not know about the proper dynamic's of poetry but I want to learn. Thank you for enlightening me.
Sunnie
Dear, dear Sunnie. Don't take my word for it. I know as little about the Haiku as the average primary school child. I just like messing around, and if you look up at some of the comments, I have already been told off for not being "serious enough".
Ian
LOl..well..you sure know more than I..not serious enough..I can't imagine :)..I love your humor..
Sunnie
Hi Ian, I only read this because it was short. No I didn't, I read it because I suspected that it would be a worthwhile use of my time, and I wasn't disappointed. Your haiku said so much, but left a whole untold story in the background. This hub is beautifully woven with wit and your ingrained excellentness ha ha I loved it. Cheers to you sir Oscar. I must have a bash at one of them haiku, um, hakoose. They can't be that difficult, can they?
My nose began to twitch
so i went
haiku, haiku, haiku.
I had a quite s bit of flack on this one, Keith. I was sort of taking the piss (Who me?) and people took me seriously. You have my permission to have a Haiku moment, but be prepared for people telling you that you have written something you've never heard of (and don't want to hear of).
Love your first effort. I am going to put you forward for the post of Poet Laureate.
OK?
I arksed the Queen about that Poet Laureate thing, Keith, and she told me to bugger off.
I arksed her why, and she said she'd read your poems and she almost peed herself laughing but it's not what Poet Laureates are supposed to be writing.
So I arksed the Emperor of Japan, cos he's Japanese (or something like that) but he also said that I could Sa~tsu to tachisaru (bugger off), but if you drop in for some sort of tea ceremony next Tuesday at four o'clock, he'll discuss Haiku stuff with you, cos he says you're well clever with words.
I didn't know about the haiku police, but i'm used to upsetting people. The post of the week sounds so much better than my usual title of the plonker of the week. I'll drink Japanese tea only when they deign to put some milk in it. I thought this hub was sort of serious and wasn't at all put out. Cheers
Very interesting and informative hub! I will say that from my knowledge of Haiku (what I learned in college), it's suppose to be in a 5-7-5 format and not just merely 17 syllables. However, I am oft known for being wrong! =P
Regardless, I am a fan of yours and love your work. Keep up the great hubbing!
Don't worry, Daniella, you are right. I got told off soundly and had to sit on the naughty stair when I posted this hub.
I've been a very, very, naughty boy.
As you could probably imagine, I am not the biggest fan of Haiku. Even though people claim that it is very difficult to write, it sounds and often looks ridiculous to me :)
I can see that few people realized where you were coming from here, and I was really enjoying those comments from people who took you seriously - this was hilarious :)
I have always been interested in why people are so damn serious all the time, as I've always been less than serious at occasions that demanded the opposite - and enjoyed it immensely...
Attaboy, Nemanja.
As you realised. I was really taking the piss... the gentle piss, but the piss all the same, and so many people thought I was being serious.
One or two were verging on the nasty, and when they started on all that crap about the "clinical beauty of perfect form and the Samurai" and all the other stuff, my first reaction, as a deep and sensitive person (Yeah! Right) was:
"Get a life!"
Thank you again,
Ian
I would have never guessed that you were like this, as I see you have shared a lot of poems here on HP. However, I now know that even people who actually write and enjoy poetry can be realistic and say that Haiku is a load of crap :) I do not have anything against Haiku or people who enjoy this form of poetry, but I maintain that I find it a bit, well, crappy.
Nemanja, I replied to your comment and then thought I would be thrown off HP for having those opinions, so have copied and pasted and am going to send it to you in an e-mail.
Cheers,
Ian
Specifically for the Faint Hearted.
For those of you who find that my poetry (and verse – there is a difference) is too long winded; these two hubs are more up your street… and continuing the “up your street analogy”, they are a very short walk.
Mark Bronze Level 4 Commenter 15 months ago
Well this is certainly more like it!!!! Very nice hub on a difficult topic but so well written as always. These poems are very delectable, one might say (especially your one).